The Fall-Out From Utah

By
May 8, 2010

Most media coverage on today's Utah voting talks about a message being sent to incumbents. I agree, though unlike some in the DC media, I think, all in all, it's a good message, not a bad one.

People shouldn't think they're getting a job for life once elected. Bennett seems like a very decent man and I don't think he was quite the faux-conservative CFG and others made him out to be. But, given his years in DC, I'm not sure how in touch with voters he was any more, either. He said he'd stay for two terms, he got three. So, it isn't like he got the short end of anything.

Three-term Sen. Bob Bennett became the first victim this year of a wave of voter anger toward Washington in a defeat that will likely send a jolt through incumbents everywhere.

Businessman Tim Bridgewater finished first in the final round of balloting, beating attorney Mike Lee 57 percent to 43 percent, meaning they will face off in a June 22 primary battle.

More surprising and perhaps even troubling to me is how the final vote turned out. Not having followed the race that closely, I expected Mike Lee to emerge on top. That didn't happen. He barely made it into a primary. But that was the goal, I guess. So, I know who lost tonight – the establishment GOP. And that ain't exactly a bad thing.

Yet, given that Bridgewater may be more establishment than Lee himself, I'm still not exactly sure who won here. Given the ability of CFG and others invested in the race to beat back Bennett, yet not deliver a win for Lee at today's convention suggests their clout is real, but not everything it's sometimes thought to be.

There is, however, five weeks to go until the primary. So, it isn't like anything is settled. But coming out of the convention down by 14 with a cash disadvantage, it's fair to say Lee and his supporters do have their work cut out for them. Ironically, in some ways, Bennett and the establishment are now the ones in position to play the spoilers, should they choose to. It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, Bennett and some other GOP figures do going forward from here.



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Comments:
  1. Dan – the fallout started 2 years ago in Utah’s 3rd CD where Jason Chaffetz defeated long time Rep Chris Cannon. Once the rest of the state saw it could be done, Sen. Bennett’s political demise was simply a matter of time.
    LL

  2. M. Report says:

    One step at a time;
    Even if the replacement is worse,
    he is better, because he is new.

  3. ThomasD says:

    These are early steps on what will prove to be a long journey. The entrenched interests will not go quietly and there will be much of the ‘two steps forward, one step back’ to come. Whoever fills the chair once occupied by Bennett has to know how the chair was made available, whether they will remember will only be proven in time.
    In the larger picture hopefully this event will serve to put others on notice that their days of triangulation, featherbedding, and ceremonial tossing of the occasional bone to their constituency are numbered. I especially take hear that this was a senator, and not some mere representative, that got the hook.
    Bennett may be a decent man, but he clearly lost sight of who he was supposed to serve.

  4. Appalled, with 2 p's. says:

    Remember, the Tea Party didn’t endorse anybody, they merely repudiated Bennett for his TARP vote. The Tea Party won today, and we’re celebrating. Senator Hatch is very worried about his own seat, and has been working very hard to look like a better tax-dollar manager.
    Win-Win.
    It certainly isn’t anti-incumbency. NOTHING would make the Utah Tea Partiers happier than Senator Hatch saying “I have seen the light, watch me like a hawk for the next 2 years”
    Hilariously enough, walking through the Democrat side on my way out, I was stopped by several different ‘concerened’ Dems, all saying the GOP had made a terrible mistake in getting rid of a great senator, who we would regret losing. Incredible, that the bastards are so committed to big government and dynasties that they openly worry about the Republicans in Utah losing a lock on a senate seat. Just mind-boggling.
    Of course, these same sanctimonious, hypocritical dirt-bags all wore Dem Delagate id tags with the proud “Hope not Hate” blazoned largely. One of them, no doubt spotting my yellow snake flag loudly asked if I were a Tea Bagger. I yelled back “Yes, I am” and then yelled a detailed description of what a tea bagger is, and my favorite techniques that I appreciate from my tea-bag-ees. Then yelled that the sexually derogative slur he yelled might possibly be related to the fact that I was also a tea-partier, and so was both. He was embarassed, and pretended not to know that was the meaning of tea-bagger, and promised not to use the term again.
    I let him off at that point, because when a lib admits ignorance, it is a great first step.
    But then he asked me why I was a tea-bagger again. The very next sentence.
    Sigh, lather, rinse, repeat with more volume and detail.
    “Not Hate” my ass.
    Hit them back twice as hard.

  5. Old One says:

    My very well connected Utah Republican relatives told me weeks ago Bennett was dead meat and that the next one to go is goa long to get along in Georgetown Orrin Hatch.
    Bennett was one of the first of the heriditary politcal class (his father was a senator from Utah)to be peeled off. I have a feeling more than a few GOP old lions are going to be driven from the pride between now and November 3. The only question one may ask is how is to what limit will Oblabla go to try to restore the defated by the dems refusing to seat those newly elected. Will it be martial law or lawfare as the democraps played with Stuart Smalley in Minnesota.

  6. jimr3 says:

    Dan,
    O/T, but Oh My!
    I see that Rick Santorum supports Sarah Palin’s endorsement of Carly Fiorina. I’m curious; like Palin, are we to now question Santorum’s judgment going forward?
    http://www.therightscoop.com/rick-santorum-supports-sarah-palins-endorsement-of-carly-fiorina/
    Also,
    Since Mitt Romney endorsed Bob Bennett (he even introduced him today), what if anything will be the fall-out for Mitt?
    Larry Sabato tweets the following:
    “Mitt Romney was backed almost unanimously by Utah GOP prez primary electorate in ’08. But his intro of Bennett this a.m.? Boos & no effect.”
    http://twitter.com/LarrySabato/status/13631393936

  7. Appalled, with 2 p's. says:

    Martial law requires the consent of the law enforcers. The law enforcers in this country are currently of the ‘support law and order’ persuasion. Some of the larger city cops might be bad enough to go along, but the large cities are overwhelmingly democrat anyway.
    Regular cops? US Military? No way.
    If congress refuses to sit the new guys the country breaks up, just like in Abe Lincoln’s day. It can’t happen here? It DID happen here. Even Obama knows that. Although, he keeps saying that Abe Lincoln is his hero. Probably for all the citizens’ rights he trampled during the civil war. Perhaps breakup of the US is another hopeful ‘crisis not to waste’.
    Well, most bankrupt corporations face dissolution and break up of the assets. Wouldn’t be that surprising if it happened to the US.

  8. “I still think he was and is a good man.”
    Dan, you raise an interesting point here. Is it possible to remain a good man in the current DC culture. Wouldn’t a “good” man have listened to the will of his constituents?

  9. Dan Riehl says:

    I addressed it via Twitter earlier, jimr. I think some in the conservative GOP establishment are somewhat out of touch with the base, too, though not as much as the moderate GOP. As for Santorum, I’ve questioned his judgement on some things for a long time, especially after he lost his Senate seat. There are some good elected cons now that adhere to principles, many don’t.
    As for Mitt, I take it he felt he had to do it. Otherwise, it was a dumb move destined to be met with defeat no matter what. But I don’t think it will cost him in Utah. And he already has issues with many in the base. SO, maybe he saw it as a wash. Don’t know. It certainly wasn’t a smart political move if he wants to court the base, just as Palin’s endorsement in CA was dumb in that specific regard.

  10. rrpjr says:

    “Not Hate” my ass.
    Hit them back twice as hard.
    Posted by: Appalled, with 2 p’s. | Saturday, May 08, 2010 at 10:53 PM
    Thanks. We all need to learn this.

  11. The Fop says:

    The problem with the GOP establishment isn’t just the politicians, it’s the RNC too. These fools just don’t seem to understand that our entire popular culture is controlled by liberals who have been waging a propaganda war against Conservatives for decades. Instead of fighting back, they cower in fear.
    I’ve said it on many blogs, and I may have already said it on this one, but I’ll say it again. Someone like Andrew Breitbart needs to be the head of the RNC. Breitbart understands that there’s a different approach that can be taken to emphasizing the “culture war”, that doesn’t focus on religious morality, but rather, exposing the bias, and the brainwashing that the MSM, the enterainment industry, and academia engage in.
    He understands that this is not something to tip toe around, lest Republicans be accused of being “too whiny”. He understands that Conservatives need to punch back twice as hard, because Katie Couric, Bill Maher and Ward Churchill don’t represent mainstream America, and people will respond positively to hard hitting. fact based attacks on their lies and hypocrisy.
    The fact that the three major arms of our popular culture are contolled by liberals needs to be repeated and proven over and over again until it seeps into the national consciousness. And it’s not enough for Rush Limbaugh to do it, the GOP must take the lead, instead of reluctantly following the Conservative New Media. Republican politicians need to be quoting chapter and verse from media watchdog groups like Newsbusters. They need to openly mock the news divisions of the three major networks and the major liberal newspapers, who are guilty and they need to be treated like they’re guilty.
    Think about it. Conservatives have one cable network that is sympathetic to them, and the Democrats don’t hesitate to attack it with guns blazing. Yet our entire popular culture is controlled by liberals and the GOP is afraid to speak up about it.
    For the Tea Party movement to truly succeed, this must be corrected, at long last.

  12. WJ Alden says:

    The Lee/Bridgewater match-up is all I could have asked for. I figured at best that Bennett would finish under 40% and we’d emerge with a single candidate, Lee or Bridgewater; or else we’d have a primary which included Bennett. In my wildest dreams I never thought possible a primary with 2 non-Bennetts.
    Bridgewater is definitely the more establishment of the two. His creds on immigration enforcement are not to be trusted. He was John McCain’s state campaign chair in 2008. He’s already lost two primaries for a congressional seat. He has deep pockets and no charisma. He just wants to be a pol.
    It’s likely that a primary, rather than elect Bridgewater, will only result in showing how ineffective the establishment has become in getting their guy through. They couldn’t keep Chris Cannon in office in 2008, and the Chaffetz/Cannon primary that year only validated the convention results. Chaffetz won 59% of delegates at the convention and 60% of voters in the primary.
    What also intrigues me is that Utah GOP delegates – 90% of them Mormon – have managed to toss out a senator who is the son of a senator and the grandson of a Mormon prophet. Robert Foster Bennett is the blueblood of Utah bluebloods. And he is toast.

  13. mariner says:

    The Fop,
    If the Republican establishment were conservative they’d have been doing this for years, but they’re not. They’re big-government, tax-and-spend statists, i.e. Democrat-lite.
    Breitbart SHOULD be the RNC head but he won’t be unless conservatives oust the current leadership.

  14. jann says:

    I want everyone to know who got this movement to move along, reinforced and who fought for us since day one. Who you say? Gov Sarah Palin that’s who. It’s so funny how underestimated she is but think that at your own peril. She has proven herself over and over again, and no one, let me say no one has been through what this woman has and succeeded and grown stronger too. If I hear one more time how she is not worthy of being the president I will remind those folks how much she has been vetted and then some. I’m not saying she will be perfect that’s not possible, but she will do the right thing always. If she chooses to take that challenge I don’t know, I hope she will, I pray she will. I also pray we have enough time to turn this mess around. My choice would be Palin/West or Bolton, Bachmann, Ryan, DeMint, and of course Andrew Breitbart as press sec. 2012!

  15. ic says:

    “Palin’s endorsement in CA was dumb …”
    Who else is running in CA primary? Campbel is terrible, proPalestinian. Anyone else?
    Remember, not all self proclaimed Teapartiers are electable. E.g the Teaparty Truther in the Texas governor primary.

  16. brooklyn says:

    This was a ‘delegate’ system. Far different than a typical voting primary alternative. It is healthy to improve candidates, especially with youth, sound conservative embraces, and such.
    However, to see Erick Erickson at Red State ‘brag’ in this fashion, is rather tiresome:
    http://www.redstate.com/erick/2010/05/08/redstate-has-the-pulse-of-the-grassroots/
    Hubris is unattractive. A small determination of delegates in UTAH is hardly the “Pulse of the Grassroots” in a Nation. Nor do I feel some of the hostile concepts about the original TARP is truly objective or accurate. The original TARP offering provided when President Bush was still in Office prior to when Democratic Partisans exploited the needed action, may prove to be essential as Mr. Krauthammer maintains.
    Fashion is thick, regretfully on the Conservative side. This is a positive, the healthy way to do it, within a Party system, to empower as a group – the best offering we can have.
    Regarding the Lawyer Mr. Lee, who still could win. I watched him provide some very provincial ‘isolationist’ concepts. I understand this is part of the current fashion, but after so much history showing the delusion in this embrace – especially with Reagan winning the Cold War, I hope we on the Conservative Side, do not embrace a ‘run away’ mentality. That is guaranteed to make matters far worse. Mr. Beck is not rationale in this arena.

  17. ic says:

    TARP was a bridge loan to banks which Uncle Sam will get back with interest. TARP was never authorized to take over GM and Chrysler. But the politicians who practise “gangster” politics did just that. It’s not Bush or Bennett’s fault.
    Obama’s “Stimulus” was a give away of taxpayers’ money to his cronies for his pet projects: green jobs, cash-for-clunkers, high-speed rails, bailout union jobs in state govts. The Dems intentionally muddled the two programs.
    Medicare Part-D was passed to stall Dems’ take over of healthcare. The pgm actually costed less than projected.
    “Conservatives” fell into the Dems’ trap by equating TARP with Stimulus, and Medicare Part-D with Obamacare.
    Won’t it be awful if the Teaparty Republican nominee lost to a Dem in Nov?
    Teaparty should not claim victory until they actually defeated the Dems in Nov.

  18. Nacilbupera says:

    Ideologically, Lee matches better with the teaparty movement a bit better than Bridgewater. But Lee has run his campaign like a lawyer while Bridgewater came across as a Horatio Alger Ragged Dick–and that made delegates bolt from Lee. The worst symptom was when Lee failed to gather the Eagar vote (4th place) with Eagar being the heart-and-sole of the teaparty. Lee needs a character adjustment otherwise Bridgewater wins. Either way Bailout Bob is gone and teaparties win as both Lee and Bridgewater. My blog has details on this race.
    Also, keep your eye on Independence Caucus: they got popular Jason Chaffetz into office 2 years ago and endorsed Eagar, Lee, and Bridgewater over Bennett. They are already stong political powerhouse in Utah and a growing movement nationwide.

  19. INVA$ION USA says:

    He had a career grade of “C-” from http://www.BetterImmigration.com
    This guy was like Juan McCain on immigration.

  20. If the Tea Party is gonna be a bear, it had better be a Grizzly. Half measures and hand-wringing, or second-guessing its better instincts will be pounced on by a GOP that knows how to close ranks and instill discipline. One seed of doubt is all they need to drive a wedge into the Tea Party resolve.
    Point of order: Sarah Palin is teh awesome, quite capable of being President, and plenty smart and savvy. However, she did not start the Tea Party. Crushing taxes and corrupt leadership started the Tea Party. But I do think she should serve as a political litmus for all who are running for office: Do you think Sarah Palin could make a good President? The Media has taught us that if you can scare a politician with a disagreeable perception of his mental prowess or associations, you’ve found their real vulnerability. They do this with Rush Limbaugh’s name all the time. Use this ploy amongst the GOP leadership and find out everything you need to know.
    Their answer will tell you what they are.
    Good grief, while the Dems are incapable of being ashamed of the likes of Nancy Pelosi or Barbara Boxer, what insufferably insecure heights of Absolute Perfection must a GOP woman candidate achieve before the good ol’ boys can feel comfortable with her as a candidate?
    You know, in the thick of the battle, it’s best to shoot ‘em all and let God sort ‘em out. The bickering and second-guessing and hoping for staid debate will weaken the movement. We have a pretty good sense of the problem, a core set of values, and momentum. If we get wrangled into fighting on GOP turf, we’re gonna lose it all.

  21. KingShamus says:

    “Breitbart SHOULD be the RNC head but he won’t be unless conservatives oust the current leadership.”
    Truth.
    He would rule.

  22. Jenny says:

    Palin might have appeal, but she is aligned with the same forces that support John McCain, she isn’t looking to advance the concerns of those millions of US citizen supporters, but merely to further advance herself by exploiting their support for her. Her endorsement of Fiorina reflects who she serves, Fiorina, a woman who spits in the face of US citizens, our constitution and bill of rights. Fiorina is like Obama, she would align herself with the Obama administration, and would be a disastrous choice. Chuck DeVore is the only truly conservative republican candidate.. which is the reason why the powers that be want him diminished.
    Have any of you noticed that the neo-cons and dems are marching in lockstep? Both are attempting to herd the republicans in the same direction, which they hope will result in pushing the goal posts in the direction of aiding Obama’s destruction of our economy and constitution. I really believe now that the neo-conservative movement formed to destroy the republican party from within.

  23. Mark_0454 says:

    Bennet had been there 18 years and he is 76 years old. If the people of Utah want someone else, that is there business.
    I want people who can make the fiscal and moral case for conservatism, people like Paul Ryan or Allen West. They may not always be right, but they have a philosophy. Bennet seems like someone whose philosophy was compromise.

  24. Ritchie The Riveter says:

    To expand upon The Fop’s point … let’s be sure to shine the spotlight on the fundamentalist zeal of the Re-, er, Progressives in their efforts to impose their worldview as the ONLY acceptable worldview in our society By. Any. Means. Necessary.
    They make the late Jerry Fawell look downright laissez-faire by comparison … in part, because of the watershed between Right and Left … the Progressives’ acceptance of ends-justify-the-means relativism as a feature, not a bug.

  25. Tom Perkins says:

    test

  26. Tom Perkins says:

    “Although, he keeps saying that Abe Lincoln is his hero. Probably for all the citizens’ rights he trampled during the civil war. Perhaps breakup of the US is another hopeful ‘crisis not to waste’.”
    No lie such as yours–even an off topic one–should go unchallenged. The Civil War was about the southern oligarchy wanting to remain the biggest fish in their pond by making their pond smaller, and by by treason at that. You can not name one genuinely unconstitutional power which the federal government sought before the war which justified the CSA’s existence. There are no inarguably unconstitutional powers it exercised during the war, and none it exercised after it until decades later, as the unrelated “Progressive” impulse caused the fed to expand past it’s bounds.

  27. JadedByPolitics says:

    funny that brooklyn attacks Erick Erickson at another site. MAN UP and take him on at his own site! The bottom line is that Erick Erickson started on Bennett a year ago because he knew that he was one of the DC insiders that could be taken down and he was RIGHT! He is certainly allowed to crow a little then get back to work. It was Erickson who introduced the GRASSROOTS to Rubio otherwise WE would have a Spectre in Florida instead of a Conservative. I should think that Conservatives who make up 40% of the population should get a Republican rep who at least votes with you in mind 75% of the time, and if they cannot they need to GO! That TARP was Republicans and Democrats saving a bunch of bankers who have 60% of GDP under their belt that is INSANE! Those banks should be broken up like the Bells were because that is too much power for one industry to have and when they go down they take the Country with them. Bennett as well wrote a “healthcare” bill with a Democrat that had the mandate which is UN-American! He as well helped pass all of those spending bills when the Republicans had the whole shebang taking more and more of Americans money then giving a tax cut whereby 47% of Americans pay NO TAXES which is UN-American as well.
    This election cycle and the next are about getting rid of Big Government Republicans as Socialist Democrats!

  28. Oh give me a BREAK, the TEA PARTY movement has NOTHING to do with getting rid of big government, what it HAS something to do with is IDIOT PEOPLE being played by BIG BUSINESS through CORRUPT LOBBYIST DICK Armey, for THEIR gain, NOT YOURS you STUPID BASTARDS!
    I HATE you ignorant TEA PARTY A$$HOLES!
    EACH and EVERY ONE of you WORTHLESS pieces of GARBAGE can GO TO HELL for bring GREAT SHAME upon this nation.
    FURTHERMORE, TRUE PATRIOTS like ME will NOT let SHEEP LIKE YOU, led by CORRUPT GARBAGE like DICK Armey ruin this country,
    and YOU can take THAT as a DIRECT CHALLENGE to YOUR STUPIDITY!
    I didn’t fight for MY COUNTRY just to see it go down in flames for the LIKES OF YOU!
    I will fight ALL enemies of this country , foreign AND DOMESTIC,
    did you “catch” that DOMESTIC part? that means YOU A$$HOLE!

  29. john says:

    DiD no One eveR exPLAin To yoU how RidicuLOus randOm CapiTalization makEs oNE SEEM to tHE otHer reADeRs?

  30. Appalled, with 2 p's. says:

    Chuck Glisson,
    Please believe me when I say that I hope all of our enemies are of your stature.
    The more formidable the enemy, the greater the challenge. Your exuberance and scathing wit are notable, and I have no doubt that you will continue to fight to the last breath of your body for what you feel is right. I only hope that we can converse together and come to a mutual understanding before the nuclear option is taken.
    You see, we deluded idiots actually believe that we are against big government, and we really do believe that we tossed Bennett out because of his broken term limits promise, and his vote on TARP which was the boulder that started the avalanche to bankruptcy.
    I must admit, I really didn’t even know Dick Army had anything to do with the Tea Party. I’ll admit that he’s pretty amazing. “The biggest lie the devil ever made was to convince people that he didn’t even exist.
    I can tell the entire point of your missive was to cause people to think introspectively, and that sometimes you just have to be pretty crude about it to get the point through thick skulls. I agree, as a couple hundred SLC Democratic convention attendees can attest to, as of yesterday.
    So thank you for your jolt of reality. You’ve certainly given me plenty to think about, especially Dick Armey.

  31. Appalled, with 2 p's. says:

    Fallout for Mit?
    After his introduction of Bennett, there were lots of people at the convention saying “Wow! He’s willing to give up his presidential run for Bennett. He’s a nice guy.” “Yeah.”

  32. To; Appalled – Thank you for taking the time to evaluate my post, the “Acid” tone of my post was not meant for a person of “reason” such as yourself, but rather the TYPICAL Tea Party IDIOT of the likes of JOHN who posted right AFTER you!
    To; John – has it OCCURED to YOU that just MAYBE the OPINION of the TYPICAL MORON such as YOURSELF does NOT mean ANYTHING to ME?
    John; THIS NATION does NOT have the time to entertain an IDIOT such as YOURSELF in the political arena at this critical time. BUZZ OFF!

  33. Tom Perkins says:

    To Chuck Glisson:
    Dick Armey is desperately spinning to be a part of the Teap Party movement, but he is not behind it, he is not a part of it. There isn’t enough structure to it for him to be any other than a hanger on.
    In other words, get your head out of your rectum.
    And learn about capitaliztion, it will help you not appear to be a jerk.

  34. DK says:

    With Mike Lee, Time Bridgewater, Bob Bennett and Cherilyn Eager, the first round of voting was 28/26/25/16 or so, very close for the top three. Eagar got knocked out and about 3% more of votes from other smaller candidates. The second round was 38/37/28 or so with Bridgewater overtaking Lee. Bennett is knocked out in 3rd place.
    Third round, 20% of the Bennett people went for the long time GOP establishment party guy, Bridgewater, who has been running and losing Utah elections for almost 10 years now.
    The reason the Bennett people went for Bridgewater was because they HATE Lee and blame him for their loss. If not for Lee, Bennett would have easily made it to a primary against Bridgewater, and then probably won the primary with his cash and name recognition and then cruised to a 4th term.
    Bridgewater is no tea party limited government guy. He’s a longtime party guy (Utah county GOP chairman once), like Bennett, establishment guy, looking to go to the senate for life, just like BB and Hatch. Tim is just saying the right things NOW, because it’s what you have to say to win today — limited government, no bailouts, no amnesty, no nationalized healthcare, fiscal responsibility, blah blah. Will he vote along those lines once he gains office? I seriously doubt it.
    The final delegate count reflected the pure hatred the Bennett people had for Lee much more than the support Bridgewater has from the “tea party” types. Lee beat Bridgewater in the first round.
    Now, how the primary will go, who knows? Whoever connects best with the hardcore non-delegate GOP voters will win I expect. There’s not a whole lot else going on in this primary so I don’t expect turnout to be exceptionally high.
    But whoever wins in the primary will be the next junior senator from Utah as there is no real Democrat opposition for this seat.
    All in all though, a great message to send, it’s made Orrin Hatch take a hard right turn.

  35. john says:

    Chuck,
    Actually I posted right after you and right before Appalled (I posted at 4:51 and he posted at 5:38). Perhaps if you weren’t so busy CAPITALIZING random words to show just how serious you are you might have actually noticed.
    If you’d like me to address the substance of your particular rant I’d be happy, but I can’t quite find it.
    You go on about Dick Armey as if he’s some boogeyman behind the scenes controlling everything and then call everybody assholes (although you naturally capitalized the word and replaced “ss” with “$$”) right before you implicitly threatened those with whom you disagree. You also claim that the Tpers bring shame, oh sorry I meant SHAME!!, upon this nation and then state that you are a true patriot.
    Nowhere do you actually provide any arguments, nowhere do you provide any sources, nowhere do you actually say anything of substance. Your remark is the internet equivalent of the spittle-flecked rant you hear from that crazy guy in the park.
    Oh, and a side note Chuck, never tell a person that you don’t care what they think after going out of your way to respond to a non-serious sentence long post making fun of a widely derided method of showing seriousness on the internet (i.e. unnecessary capitalization)

  36. SacTownMan says:

    Wow Chuckie is a real A$$HOLE isn’t he?
    Can you say LOSER?? I thought you could!!
    Bride of Chuckie has got to be a real winner herself!!
    Daily Koz is one dipsh#t short today!!

  37. SacTownMan says:

    Wow I made the mistake of clicking on Chuckie’s name link!!
    Chuckie maybe you should give that Carver guitar to someone that knows how to use it, might I suggest Allan Holdsworth.
    I love that whole 80’s rock star look. I’m sure that your lame assed garage band has made you very successful in your quest for fame!!
    You are living proof of the need for birth control!! You really are an angry little troll aren’t you!!
    Dude you really need to up the meds or increase the size of your bong loads, your BDS is terminal!!
    What a complete douche bag!!!

  38. Let’s get something STRAIGHT SacTownMan. I don’ t give A DAMM what YOU think about MY music. I am the ORIGINAL owner of THAT 80’s guitar as YOU’d like to refer to it as, and I may not be a famous musician, and it does not bother me that I’m not, because many of the BEST musicians AERN’T!
    But I can say ONE THING for SURE. I have played MORE REAL venues than a WANNABE LIKE YOU who has NEVER played ANYWHERE!
    So tell me SacTownMan, what music do YOU play?
    Oh that’s right YOU DON’T, but you waste YOUR TIME putting down OTHER MUSICIANS who ARE following their passion.
    BTW, since you NEVER left your REAL name, or a LINK, I must assume that you are a COWARD, as well as a JADED WANNABE!

  39. Paige Turner says:

    Hey SacTownMan,
    I have you pegged as one those guys who spend their whole Saturday drool all over the guitars, boring the poor salesman to tears, and then going home and getting on Craig’s List and posting an add as a musician, an add that you will never follow up on because you can’ t play guitar[they call that a "Kook"]. That’s why you are so fast to put someone else down who does actually play, it comes down to resentment. I may or may not like the music of any one musician out there, but I would never put them down for trying. Besides most famous musicians started out from humble beginnings, and changed direction many many times before finding the final path that led to success.
    It must suck to be you SacTownMan