Al Gore's Inconvenient Loot

Former Vice President Al Gore has built a Green money-making machine capable of eventually generating billions of dollars for investors, including himself, but he set it up so that the average Joe can't afford to play on Gore's terms. And the US portion is headed up by a former Gore staffer and fund raiser who previously ran afoul of both the FEC and the DOJ, before Janet Reno jumped in and shut down an investigation during the Clinton years.

As Bill Hobbs first pointed out, Gore supposedly pays for his extra-large carbon footprint through Generation Investment Management (GIM) - and if you're looking to go green, and have your wallet go along with Gore, think again - average people are too insignificant to play - verifiable from this pdf.

Generation is based in London, with its U.S. offices in Washington, DC. The firm will manage the assets of institutional investors such as pension funds, foundations and endowments, as well as those of select high net worth individuals.* Generation expects to make extensive use of long-term performance based fees. Generation will begin its investment management business in early 2005.

* like Al Gore

Gore's company, GIM was specifically established to take financial advantage of new technologies and solutions related to combating Global Warming. The Global Warming crowd has told us that just recently new science emerged confirming the alleged fact that Global Warming is man made. So, ask yourself, why is it that Gore set up his Green money machine three years ago back in 2004? Is it possible Gore knew what the science would say before it was out? And even if not, can an individual who stands to make millions from Global Warming really be trusted as an honest broker on that topic? Talk about giving the fox the keys to the hen penthouse.

Even if Global Warming did exist, in principle, what's the difference between war profiteering and this? One could justifiably argue that Gore is taking advantage of, in his opinion, a catastrophic situation to clean up - and I don't mean the environment.

Here's a list indicating what it takes to make money along with Al. Funds associated with these companies have placed millions of dollars under Al Gore's control. And, as you'll see below, Gore's selection for the US President of GIM might raise a few eyebrows as well.

AFLAC INC - AQUANTIVE INC - AUTODESK INC - BECTON DICKINSON & CO BLACKBAUD INC - GENERAL ELECTRIC CO - GREENHILL & CO INC - JOHNSON CTLS INC - LABORATORY CORP AMER HLDGS - METABOLIX INC - NORTHERN TR CORP - NUVEEN INVTS INC -STAPLES INC - SYSCO CORP - TECHNE CORP - UBS AG - VCA ANTECH INC - WATERS CORP - WHOLE FOODS MKT INC

According to their own documents, GIM intends to invest in, or buy companies poised to cash in on Global Warming concerns. If we borrow John Edward's so-called two Americas concept for a second, this all means higher prices and taxes with more regulation and an altered standard of living for people like you and me, while Al Gore sits ensconced in his other America reaping profits from each new government mandate for us, business and even government itself. It's win win, alright, but mostly for Al.

To add insult to injury, Gore chose Peter S. Knight, an old friend and colleague some are sure to recall, as the US President of GIM.

Peter S. Knight, formerly Managing Director Met West Financial, lawyer, Chief of Staff for Senator Al Gore (D-TN) from 1977-1989, and Campaign Manager for President Clinton's successful re-election in 1996, is President of Generation U.S.

This would be him:   Reno Rejects Inquiry Into a Clinton Aide

Atty Gen Janet Reno decides against any further investigation of Peter Knight, Pres Clinton's 1996 campaign manager in connection with office building development in nation's capital; such an investigation could have led to naming independent counsel to look further into activities of Knight, who is also former top assistant to Vice Pres Al Gore.

Yes, thanks to Janet Reno, no one ever found out how $20,000 in stock turned up in an account for Knight's then 13 year old child.

Dispute over Democratic Party campaign-financing shifts to Zachary Knight, 13-year-old son of Peter S Knight, Clinton-Gore campaign chairman in 1996, who was given $20,000 in stock by William Haney 3d, chairman of Molten Metal Technology Inc; Republicans believe gift, which came after father was named chairman of campaign, was really payment to Knight, who had worked as $7,000-per-month lobbyist for company; Knight denies involvement in any impropriety; photo

If Gore's motivation in pushing Global Warming is so altruistic, was it really necessarily for the already wealthy Gore to establish a multi-million dollar corporation in England to cash in? And given the history of Gore and Knight, are these people we should trust to drive a re-vamping of the world economy at the same time they're lining their pockets because of our much smaller carbon footprints?

If Al Gore is successful with this latest scheme, Gore and his cronies are going to be much more $green$ than most of the earth. And the only green in this for you and me is the kind that accompanies envy as Gore trucks around on private jets putting dollars to offset his extravagance into a cash machine generating profits on the backs of the middle class with misrepresented science that doesn't deserve to be called science at all.

Mr. Gore starts out, ironically enough, asserting the importance of peer-reviewed science. I call this ironic because the misrepresentation that follows (a) hasn’t been peer reviewed, and (b) the peer-reviewed literature contradicts the misrepresentation.

From the Center For Public Integrity: one of the issues involving both Knight and carbon friendly Al was the installation of a hot tub and steam shower in the Master Bedroom of the VP's house. How Green is that?

Here's what the Center found about some of the most generous contributors to the foundation: Peter S. Knight...

Peter S. Knight, Gore's former chief of staff, managed Gore's first bid for the presidency in 1988. In 1989, he began lobbying for the firm Wunder, Diefendorfer, Cannon and Thelan. Given his closeness to Gore and the rest of the Clinton administration, corporations now pay Knight upward of $10,000 a month to wield his influence with Gore. With the help of his new clients, Knight soon cemented a new role for himself as Gore's "chief of fund raising."

Since 1996, Knight's various lobbying and fund-raising activity has been the subject of a Federal Election Commission investigation, a Justice Department inquiry and two House Commerce Committee probes.

Gore chose Knight to act as chairman of the foundation during Gore's first vice presidential term. Three of Knight's clients - millionaire publishing magnate Vance Opperman, Bell Atlantic and Fluor Corporation — showered the foundation with $10,000 each.

Knight also solicited $10,000 contributions from foundations run by Atlantic Richfield Company (ARCO), Coca-Cola Company, MCI Communications (now MCI WorldCom, Inc.), Time Warner Inc. and Microsoft Corporation (Chairman Bill Gates also contributed a $30,000 glass sculpture). Under Gore's supervision, the foundation pledged to take corporate money only through their foundations, not from corporations directly. The $10,000 paid by the Coca-Cola Company, however, came out of the corporate account.

Comments

[Buzzy]

This is ALL about hypocrisy. Al Gore wants everyone to live in a manner he himself refuses to. I don't even have a big problem with him wanting to cash in on carbon offsets except that I believe they promote the same exact "pollute all you want if you buy these" deals that has gotten us all living in a pollution filled world in the first place. Pretty much Gore got caught the same as that evangelist guy (Haggard) who got caught with male prostitutes and shooting up meth.

If Gore was serious about reducing his carbon footprint and living in a manner that promoted ecology then he'd live in a house like this:

Geothermal heat pumps located in a central closet circulate water through pipes buried 300 feet deep in the ground where the temperature is a constant 67 degrees; the water heats the house in the winter and cools it in the summer. Systems such as the one in this "eco-friendly" dwelling use about 25% of the electricity that traditional heating and cooling systems utilize.

A 25,000-gallon underground cistern collects rainwater gathered from roof runs; wastewater from sinks, toilets and showers goes into underground purifying tanks and is also funneled into the cistern. The water from the cistern is used to irrigate the landscaping surrounding the four-bedroom home. Plants and flowers native to the high prairie area blend the structure into the surrounding ecosystem. http://www.commondreams.org/views01/0429-03.htm

Some people might find it strange that this house is owned by George W. Bush near Crawford Texas.

[Gary Maxwell]

Gore is marketing to sophisticated investors ( in this case a subset known as rich stupid liberals with guilty consciences ). He is drawing a salary from GIM as well so his whole offsets spiel absolving himself from being an energy hog, rings a bit hollow to me. Unsophisticated investors (ie most Americans )could not even buy from this company and would never be granted a officer title and a large salary even if they could. Bet me the money/salary is outsized to his time contribution and exceeds the cost of his procured credits. In other words a sham.

And finally I could care less if Gore makes money doing this. But going around the country giving speeches scolding everyone on their excessive energy usage and the resulting CO2 emissions is frankly galling.

[Michael Evilcorn]

Never mind. From one of the above links to The Tennessean:
"Gore helped found Generation Investment Management, through which he and others pay for offsets. The firm invests the money in solar, wind and other projects that reduce energy consumption around the globe..."

[charles]

watching the leftists defend the indefensible is highly entertaining

isn't the goracle the same guy i saw on stage last week telling me that global warming is a moral problem?

his lack of morals is showing

instead of defending gore, why aren't you people supporting clean carbon free nuclear power?

[Thomas McCord]

Can anyone tell me what AFLAC (the duck in TV ads), Staples (office supplies), UBS (finacial services), and Sysco (canned foods) have to do with carbon credits?

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"If Gore was serious about reducing his carbon footprint...\"

He\'d convert to Green energy, install solar panels, use energy efficient lighting, work from home, buy carbon credits, and...wait, that\'s EXACTLY what he\'s doing. For wingnuts Gore can only be serious if he wasn\'t rich, traveled the world via experimental gliders, and lived in a tent.

\"promoted ecology then he\'d live in a house like this:\"

How do you know what kind of house Al Gore lives in? All you know of his house is the amount of his power bill. And you are making assumptions based solely on that?

\"scolding everyone on their excessive energy usage\"

Soclding? When? Where? I DARE you to provide me such an example of scolding. Saying the earth is in trouble and this is how you can help is not scolding as much as you lie to yourself and wish it were so.

[charles]

Thomas

you're going to have to wait until they receive their talking points on this

until then they will be incapable of answering, or even knowing that which you mention in your post

[Zifnab]

"The point is that these investments are being trumped as doing enough to offset typical (or excessive) carbon consumption by other individuals. I'm sorry, we're not convinced, we're just supposed to take Al Gore's word. You wouldn't if you were on the other side of the debate, so don't expect us to.

And if (as I strongly suspect) the balance sheets really aren't balancing with regard to carbon impact, don't people concerned about the impact of CO2 really want to know this information? Because if that's the case, then the we're all just digging ourselves deeper in the hole, maybe at a slightly slower rate."

That's fine. Don't trust Al Gore. He's just bringing the argument to the table again, after years of environmentalism being turned into a dirty word.

Al Gore's initatives might be flawed, they might even be completely wrong. But no one seemed interested in even talking about CO2 emitions two years ago. So, by all means, bring the issue up and let's hash out a solution to the problem.

Too often, the response has been "It's not important" and that's done more damage than anything else so far.

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"why aren\'t you people supporting clean carbon free nuclear power?\"

Do you want to drive a nuclear powered car, jackass?

Instead of joining the anti-science fight with your fellow Creationists and Flat Earthers, why don\'t you wingnuts do something useful...like ask Dan Riehl why he\'s ignoring the scandal at Walter Reed?

[Boris]

"So, ask yourself, why is it that Gore set up his Green money machine three years ago back in 2004?"

Uh, the scientific consensus on AGW has been around longer than that. Read the IPCC TAR, 2001. Nice try, though.

GIM does not sell carbon offsets to the public, but they offset the carbon footprints of all thier employees including Gore's. There's a hydro project in Bolivia nad Solar projects in India and Sri Lanka. There are plenty of places for the "average joe" to buy carbon offsets, like Terrapass.

So you guys think it's unfair that rich people get to invest and poor people don't? Or is this selective outrage? Again.

[iftheshoefits]

Two questions for all the defenders of Al Gore's behaviors as they currently stand:

1. If it was demonstrated that, in the aggregate, the activities that are being incentivized by the current market in carbon offsets had negligible impact on the amount of anthropogenic CO2 being released into the atmosphere, would you want to
a. do everything you could to correct that situation, or
b. would you not really care that much?

2. (OK, I know this one is reeely hypothetical for Global warming true believers, but humor me): If it becomes evident that anthropogenic CO2 is an insignifcant factor on mean global temperatures, will you feel
a. incredibily relieved
b. disappointed
c. really wouldn't care one way or the other

Just curious.

[Gary Maxwell]

Well I agree with the lefties about one thing. W must be a dumb ass. Why go to all the expense to practice energy conservation when you can just set up a company and mint yourself a little certificate that says you are Carbon Neutral. In triplicate. With goldleaf and serrated edge. For this bit of wisdom we have Al Gore to thank.

[charles]

mjy good job with the childish name calling - you're beginning to win me over

i want to drive a rechargable electric vehicle and don't want to create any co2 to power it jackass

i am not anti science a creationist or a flat earther, i am a pro clean sustainable safe no co2 anywhere in the equation nuclear power advocate

why is al gore being immoral?

and i guess you missed bushs statement today about how the conditions at the bureaucratic branch of walter reed are unacceptable, and must be changed along with investigating all the other va hospitals across the country so conditions there if unacceptable can be changed as well

why are you only interestedin walter reed, could it be you don't know any better because you haven't received your talking points yet?

you sound like someones sock puppet, your posts look familiar for some reason

[yyy]

Al Gore has to be destroyed because the wingnuts cannot stand the idea that you can be 'carbon neutral' and not live in a mud hut without electricity, as they say everyone will have to in order to lower carbon emissions.

They also can't abide the idea of any liberal, tree hugger, environmentalist, believer in global warming being able to make money without destroying the the environment.

Lastly, none of these dopes know what a hedge fund is anyway, probably some quasi commie plot, doncha know.

And, besides, its cold today, so global warming doesn't exist.

[iftheshoefits]

"Can anyone tell me what AFLAC (the duck in TV ads), Staples (office supplies), UBS (finacial services), and Sysco (canned foods) have to do with carbon credits?"

I thought the SYSCO entry was pretty curious myself. I live in a remote town where the Sysco truck comes in from long distances each week, hauling mostly non-organic, pre-packaged foods and produce to restaurants and quick-stops that are too lazy to develop local or regional sources. Kind of like "Wal-Mart on wheels". Not that there's anything wrong with that, but yeah, how exactly are the carbon offsets being generated here? There may be a real explanation - maybe they're switching to bio-diesel for their fleet or something similar. Let's hear about it.

And Becton Dickinson I also found as to be interesting. I worked there for eight years. They're a great company, though I never heard a word about reducing energy usage from them. OK, so it's been awhile, I checked their most recent annual report, which I still get as a shareholder. They are touting themselves as one of Business Ethics "100 best corporate citizens". From what I can see, their good boy scout credits are coming from their efforts to alleviate suffering through donations of medical products through UNICEF efforts and such - they're a healthcare products company (catheters, needles, diagnostic products, etc.)

This is excellent and should be widely recognized and commended. And I salute Al Gore's investments in such a fine company. But what does this have to do with reducing atmospheric CO2?

Can everyone agree on what the precise definition of a carbon offset is, given this information? Because the definition "I say I'm doing enough good deeds to compensate" doesn't wash. Maybe if we start there, we can work toward getting on the same page.

At least if reducing CO2 quantities is in fact the real issue at hand.

[charles]

"They also can't abide the idea of any liberal, tree hugger, environmentalist, believer in global warming being able to make money without destroying the the environment"

no, i can't abide one of the loudest proponents who claims manmade co2 emissions are causing global warming and leading to a moral, not political problem is buying their way out of it rather than reducing the amount produced, or reducing the amount of energy they consume

in his own words al is immoral

[Gary Maxwell]

Iftheshoefits

Stop with the rational behavior already! If Al says he is Carbon Neutral and says he has a certificate that says so ( no matter that the printing press is in his six car garage ), who are we to question it? After all you can read above just like I did, what's important is that he is "bringing the question to the table again." Not that he is a pompous ass who is quite hypocritical!

Why would you want to know answer to question like "how" and " who did the calculations"? Or to put it another way cribbing from above "you must be a commie jackass dope etc etc." And wait for it a Halliburton reference is sure to show up just about any second now.

[yyy]

He is reducing the amount of energy he consumes, he has released information on exactly how. In addition to taking steps to reduce the actual amount of energy he consumes, he also has taken steps to 'offset' his energy by other means including carbon trading. In effect, he's taken advantage of the solutions that currently exist, short of living in a mud hut and traveling around the globe by rickshaw and sail boat.

It is typical and typically repulsive that the wingnuts would compare war profiteering to investment in green companies and technologies.

It is the wingnuts who believe that liberal and making money are incompatible, thus, anyone who is rich and liberal must, by definition, be hypocritical.

The idea that any kind of positive solutions to global warming that could actually make money rather than destroy the entire American and world economy as the wingnuts complain, can't be allowed. It runs contrary to all wingnut philosophy.

Those who believe in global warming want to destroy our economy, take away our cars, electricity and our houses...

Al Gore living in a masion, making money off of green investments and STILL living a carbon neutral life HAS TO BE A LIE.

Otherwise, the whole global warming denier fear monger line of reasoning falls apart.

[iftheshoefits]

"He is reducing the amount of energy he consumes, he has released information on exactly how."

I'm interested. Link, please, if you would.

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"why are you only interestedin walter reed\"

I\'m not. Neither are \'the left\' or liberals only interested in Walter Reed. Or the troops or our Vets.

It was liberals that waved their arms to bring attention to the lack of uparmored HumVees.

It was liberals that caused a stink about the lack of body armor.

It was liberals that payed attention to the cuts in the V.A.

Liberals are protesting the overuse of our National Guard and their lack of readiness.

Liberals are giving the Walter Reed story the play it deserves.

It is conservatives that throw the troops into battle to show how big their dicks are. It\'s conservatives that attack the troop who dared mention the lack of armor for his Humvee. It\'s conservatives who defend the cuts to the V.A. as not being cuts, but a reduction in the increases. It\'s conservatives who refuse to extend debt protection to our soldiers fighting abroad. It\'s conservatives who don\'t give a single solitary fuck about wounded soldiers sleeping in their own urine until it\'s exposed by a liberal reporter. Supporting the troops for you means using them willy nilly and sticking a faded Chinese magnetic yellow ribbon on your car and tattered American flag out your window.

Al Gore\'s big house and Barack Obama\'s slave owning ancestors are all the rage in the Wingnutosphere. If the right cared about the troops, why isn\'t this story #1 on Instapundit, or Riehl World View or FreeRepublic. Dan Riehl, and charles, and Hard Right, and the rest of you that pledge fealty to the boy king ignore stories like Walter Reed, or insufficient body armor, or ill equipped humvees until you can\'t escape it. I had to mention the scandal in every one of my posts before one of you troop haters dared mention it. And when you did, it was to attack me...for bringing it up.

[charles]

Al Gore living in a masion, making money off of green investments and STILL living a carbon neutral life HAS TO BE A LIE.

you heard it here first folks, using more energy than any normal person could and living a life of conspicuous consumption is a carbon neutral lifestyle, if you can afford to buy your way out of it that is

why is algore so immoral?

[yyy]

Kreider said that context includes the efforts the Gores have made to use renewable energy sources and to conserve energy, including the following:

— Taking part in TVA’s “Green Power Switch” program, which means that power coming into their home is through solar, wind and renewable energy. That makes their electric bill more expensive, Kreider noted.

— Upgrading their home to reduce their energy consumption through energy efficient windows and appliances. Also having solar panels installed.

— Driving hybrid vehicles.

— Purchasing “offsets” to counteract their “overall carbon footprint,” which means the Gores consider all of the pollution they emit through their numerous activities, both at home and traveling, and then make financial contributions to renewable power projects elsewhere.

Kreider said Gore signed up for the “Green Power Switch” program last year, but she could not immediately say exactly when.

[charles]

holy crap mjy - i can actually see the spittle flying from your lips

that's a very hard thing to achieve on the internet

i am in awe of your prowess

[Gary Maxwell]

Al Gore got most of his wealth from his Dad. He is a trust fund baby who never had a real job and has been in politics for generations and now has a lifetime pension for his Congressional and V?P service. The wealth came from several sources but one of the most significant is the zinc mines in Carthage. Zinc strip mining is a pretty dirty enterprise but I guess if its the Goracle, you must worship at his altar.

Lots of hedge funds make money, some dont. Since this one seems to be quite miserly with information, there just might be some reason to remain skeptical about (1) whether he is making anything out of this beyond a salary (2) whether the company is making a profit even and (3) exactly how are the carbon offsets being created and who is doing the calculations. It aint even kosher until the Rabbi blesses it in other words.

[iftheshoefits]

Do the defenders of carbon offsets in their present form realize that there has been a global capacity crunch for solar panels for over the last two years? I have a hard time getting solar panels in the configurations that I want, at decent prices anymore. This is currently the biggest limitation to efforts in limiting the growth of atmospheric CO2 from solar-generated replacement. Every government subsidy that comes on line at present (and there are quite a few of them, the republican congress passed a big one two years ago) simply increases the demand for solar panels, thereby raising prices even more. Solar panel prices have increased 25-30% over the past couple years.

I would think that this would be an incredible investment opportunity for carbon trading companies, to invest in the very capital-intensive start-up monies needed to bring silicon processing facilities on line. But it is extremely risky, that is, you can easily lose your entire investment. A lot more bottom-line effective than planting trees, though, I would think.

Can anyone tell me if any of these carbon offset trading companies are funding raw solar silicon or solar panel startups? Because from what I see, most of that investment is coming from large Pacific-rim conglomerates such as Sharp and Honda. But there are US-based players and startups (Nanosolar, Evergreen, etc.) Is any carbon offset money going into those?

[yyy]

You people are pathetic.

One would think, given the conservative belief that the 'free market' solves everything and unfettered capitalism has been a gift to humanity that you would be applauding the idea of finding ways to make money without further damaging the enviroment. Wouldn't a green hedge fund be exactly the kind of response a true conservative would come up with?

But, no.

Instead, you attack Al Gore for being rich, then for not making his own money, then for being on board an investment vehicle designed to profit and support green companies...

Who are the hypocrites in this story?

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"you heard it here first folks, using more energy than any normal person could\"

Yes, because former Vice President - Senator - Nobel Prize nominee - large multiple business owner - TV producer - High Demand Speaker is just like a \'normal\' person. Normal people have to attend conferences in Asia and have secret service details. Would you please stop dishonestly comparing Al Gore\'s energy use to \"normal\" persons?

\"i am in awe of your prowess\"

The wounded Iraq vets sleeping in their own urine thank you for your cleverness in not giving a shit.

[charles]

i'm attacking algore for being this centurys savoranolla

if co2 is causing global warming the most sensible way of dealing with the problem is to reduce its production

why isn't algore advocating clean greenhouse friendly nuclear energy?

[charles]

"The wounded Iraq vets sleeping in their own urine thank you for your cleverness in not giving a shit."

you have stepped way out over the line here son

go fuck yourself, you foul piece of shit

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"you heard it here first folks, using more energy than any normal person could\"

Yes, because former Vice President - Senator - Nobel Prize nominee - large multiple business owner - TV producer - High Demand Speaker is just like a \'normal\' person. Normal people have to attend conferences in Asia and have secret service details. Would you please stop dishonestly comparing Al Gore\'s energy use to \"normal\" persons?

\"i am in awe of your prowess\"

The wounded Iraq vets sleeping in their own urine thank you for your cleverness in not giving a shit.

[charles]

just to be sure you don't miss this

"The wounded Iraq vets sleeping in their own urine thank you for your cleverness in not giving a shit."

you have stepped way out over the line here son

go fuck yourself, you foul piece of shit

[yyy]

Al Gore isn't advocating nuclear energy because as the solution to global warming because he doesn't think enough countries will ever build enough nuclear reactors to get the job done.

Not to mention the radioactive waste that has to be burried in the mountains or dropped in the ocean might, ya know, have unintended consequences down the road.

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"go fuck yourself, you foul piece of shit\"

to borrow someone\'s phrase:

\"i can actually see the spittle flying from your lips. That\'s a very hard thing to achieve on the internet. I am in awe of your prowess\"

Well, you go to war with the insufficient body armor, up armored humvees, debt protection, medical care, multiple troop rotations, insufficient combat troops levels, and poor planning your Republcian civilian leadership has not the insufficient body armor, up armored humvees, debt protection, medical care, multiple troop rotations, insufficient combat troops levels, and poor planning you may want.

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"go fuck yourself, you foul piece of shit\"

to borrow someone\'s phrase:

\"i can actually see the spittle flying from your lips. That\'s a very hard thing to achieve on the internet. I am in awe of your prowess\"

Well, you go to war with the insufficient body armor, up armored humvees, debt protection, medical care, multiple troop rotations, insufficient combat troops levels, and poor planning your Republcian civilian leadership has not the insufficient body armor, up armored humvees, debt protection, medical care, multiple troop rotations, insufficient combat troops levels, and poor planning you may want.

[yyy]

On the other issue,

The wingnuts appear to support the troops only in the abstract, in that they support the troops going to war, winning the war and they support whatever means the troops may resort to..torture, murder, rape, etc. to get the job done.

The wingnuts generally appear uninterested in the details about how the troops might come to win any war...their recruitment, training, resources in the field, salaries, mental health, medical care or even the long term harm that turning a blind eye to rape, murder and torture might do to the 'troops' down the road are not big items in the wingnut world.

They appear only to care about the 'the troops' in so much as they are a symbol of their patriotism and desire and love for war. The actual people who comprise 'the troops' are uninteresting to them.

[iftheshoefits]

"One would think, given the conservative belief that the 'free market' solves everything and unfettered capitalism has been a gift to humanity that you would be applauding the idea of finding ways to make money without further damaging the enviroment. "

Strawmen and hyperbole aside, you're correct. The whole point of the post (and the discussion, I had hoped) is to question whether Al Gore's particular investments were having the carbon neutral effects that he claims. This is al the more curious especially when considering that he's channelling them through companies he owns, meaning that the more alarmism he can generate, the more potential money he makes.

Since he's leading the global charge here, if Al Gore's investments are not at all effective in reducing CO2, and if in fact the offsets are merely providing a false sense of cover for people to consume more fossil-based energy, then the net effect is not what we want.

Again, this is only true if the real desire here is to reduce the amount of anthropogenic CO2 dumped into the atmosphere.

[Gary Maxwell]

Excuse me for interrupting, but does anyone have a laser printer? Reason I ask is I keep getting this damn printer ink on my hands cuz the inkjet printer does not dry quick enough and I keep smearing my Neutral footprint certificates. If you would be willing to donate your laser printer to the cause, we will add it to the substantial assets ( uhumm ) of my Sub S corp and we will start calling it henceforth a "hedge fund". Throw some green Earth mumbo jumbo too. Now we dont talk about the assets or anything else of this fund so mums the word. You will become a officer and one of the bennies of the job is you get Neutral Footprint certificates for life. Now any salry will be offset by the cost to you for these certificates but hey try buying some from GIM and see where that leads you when they laugh and then hang up. Impress your moonbat friends, be the first on your block and step right up.

[charles]

yyy look up pellet bed nuclear reactor

mjy - you would never in a million years have the balls to say that to my face

you have anonymously embarassed yourself in public

that is one of the foulest things i have ever seen posted here

you should be ashamed, but only someone with no shame could be capable of saying such a thing

i was only snarking, but you are obviously a very sick person

our dialogue is over

[iftheshoefits]

Hey guys (both on the right and left):

We're trying to have an energy discussion here. If you want to go on about Iraq, there must be at least 10,000 other active posts somewhere out on the tubes, where you can have at it.

[yyy]

So, you think that Al Gore doesn't really believe or care about global warming, it's all a sham to make money, is that what you are saying?

The man who spent his life in public service, living off of his family money, all of a sudden decides he wants to make his own millions and is going to use fake global warming to do it?

You have got to be kidding me. Sadly, I'm sure you are not kidding me.

Do you also believe the world is 6,000 years old and global warming doesnt' matter because when Jesus comes for the faithful it will be a moot point?

[Gary Maxwell]

Is there a point in all that slobber and ranting somewhere?

[yyy]

The question is pretty simple.

Is it your belief that Al Gore does not believe that global warming is a problem that is exacerbated by the burning of fossil fuels, but is instead cynically exploiting the global warming 'lie' in order to make money as your previous post seems to indicate?

yes or no

[charles]

"So, you think that Al Gore doesn't really believe or care about global warming"

what year was the kyoto treaty first brought up in congess?

why wasn't it passed?

why did that years administration opt out?

[Gary Maxwell]

I think Al Gore like many many liberals believes that the government directives and restrictions that he would impose on others does not really apply to him.

[mightyjoeyoung]

There was no dialogue.

I was wondering why no right wing blogs are showing outrage over what happened at Walter Reed? Just like the right showed no real concern over the lack of body armor, medical care, debt relief, and mental health care of our fighting men and women in Iraq.

I seemed to have hit a bullseye. You got caught charles. I am seriously concerned about what\'s going on in Walter Reed and you want to play some snark game. Your guilt is showing. Where\'s the concern over the troops sleeping in their own urine, troop lover? Why aren\'t you mad at RWV or FreeRepublic or Assrocket for ignoring this story? Why get mad at me for noticing how you would rather not talk about it?

To quote the right wing: \"Can we question your patriotism now?\"

[yyy]

There is no basis for that belief, since he's already provided ample proof of his own personal actions to reduce his carbon use and has provided a financial vehicle that offsets his use.

Again, the idea of carbon trading is a much more conservative idea than a liberal one. The typical liberal idea would be to force wholsesale changes/reductions, etc. Carbon trading is a near term pragmatic solution that could reduce the OVERALL CO2 emissions. The planet doesn't really care who is burning fossil fuels, the US, the Chinese or the Jamaicans. If carbon trading enables a global reduction, for what reaosn would anyone be against this?

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"If you want to go on about Iraq\"

I want to go on about Walter Reed instead of Al Gore\'s big house. But I can;t seem to find too many posts about Walter Reed anywhere on the right wing internets but a million posts about Al Gore\'s big house. Why is that?

[mightyjoeyoung]

\"The planet doesn\'t really care who is burning fossil fuels\"

Rush Limbaugh played an audio clip of Chuck Heston reading from Jurassic Park about life finding a way. He was deriding liberals for being arrogant that they think they could change how the world works over millions of years.

I know life finds a way, but I\'d like to keep this planet as hospitable as possible for humankind as long as possible.

J

[yyy]

It's my opinion the global warming deniers are going to be viewed by history the same way as the witch burners and the people who imprisoned Gallileo for being a heretic.

Unfortunately, by the time global warming could ever conclusively be proven to be caused/accelerated by fossil fuels these nut jobs will be long dead, my best understanding from the wingnuts is that we would need to see several hundred years of ongoing warming for them to even consider the idea that it was manmade, by that time it will be Waterworld.

[supernintendo Chalmers]

haven't made it all the way down, but this blog is a hoot!

"al gore has never had a real job in his life blahblahblah" and so forth.

HAHAHAHAHHAHABWAAHA HA!

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